Having trouble posting or changing forum settings? The MG Experience www. Single stage urethane paint with clearcoat, good or bad? Posted by lvzak.
Page 1 2 3. I am using a single stage urethane pale primrose paint. Will the clearcoat change the color?
Sponsored Links. Re: Single stage urethane paint with clearcoat, good or bad? Stunning results. Last edit at AM by chgrec. Dave Braun. Top Contributor. Test the color on a steel panel with the same priming system. A clear of lessor quality may have a slight tint to it. Avoid those. Stay within your paint manufacturer's product system and you will have better results. Warmly, dave.
Berwick, NS, Canada. You should probably follow the directions on the tin. I always thought the single stage paints did not require a clear coat. Benny Ben E. In reply to by rpiccola I always thought the single stage paints did not require a clear coat. In reply to by pinkyponk You should probably follow the directions on the tin. HL Miller Henry Miller. You want to use the highest quality clear in the same line of single stage paint that you're using.
You do not need to let it dry and resand to clear, but the single stage needs to be almost dust free before it is ready to clear. You cannot have any runs or sags in the single stage, or you will not be able to clear it without first letting it dry and sanding out the defect. I've done this on several cars without a problem, but I paint every day.
I'll also say that you can get a great job with single state without the clear. But the benefits to those who ask are this: When base coat clear coat paint jobs fail, they tend to delaminate. When a single-stage job begins to fail, it tends to oxidize.
The clear coat on top of single stage- which has its own UV inhibitors in addition to the clearintegrates very well with the single stage, and will not fail by delamination. If this is your first paint job, or you have not done several, I would recommend base clear or single-stage that is not cleared over.Our tech hotline answers lots of calls every day about everything we sell, and how best to use it.
A lot of questions are about welding and technique, and a lot of questions concern paint and applying it. We are happy to answer those, and any other automotive related topics. Recently a customer called with a question about mixing single stage urethane paints with a urethane clear.
Single stage paint already has plenty of gloss and is UV stabilized to be used as a top coat by itself. So, you may ask why mix a single stage color coat with a clear top coat? When people do this it is typically because they have been painting since the lacquer days, or the person who taught them was from that era.
Lacquer paints are easy to spray, and dry to a hard, high gloss shine quickly. They used to be the standard paint if you were spraying candy, metal flake or pearl, and they would produce a finish that looked a mile deep. But, one of the big problems with lacquer is it is not very durable.
The colors fade with UV exposure, and it is so hard it will crack and craze over time. After laying out a killer lacquer color spray job, guys would spray several more coats mixing color with clear. It was though this would produce a deeper looking paint job, by having several semi-clear coats, and protect the underlying color from UV damages over time.
Then several clear coats over the top. Many guys like to spray cars this way even to this day, no matter what paint they are using. Modern Urethanes. There is no need to use this method with modern urethane single stage paint.
The MG Experience
However, if you do want to do it this way because that is what you are comfortable with, you can. Here is the most important thing to remember if mixing color and clear 2K urethanes.
Make sure each paint and activator is thoroughly mixed in the correct ratio, before mixing the 2 different paints together. Just because the 2 paints are compatible does not mean you can just dump all 4 parts into a can and mix with good results. There is really no way to know exactly how an activator will react to a different paint. If you have done it in the past with lacquer, just follow your traditional mix. Some guys suggest spraying aand finally a with mostly clear, followed by pure clear.
The most important thing to remember is that if you are using a 2 stage paint, you must spray 2 good coats of pure clear over the top of any mixed coat to prevent the color from fading with time. Because single stage urethanes and clear urethanes are compatible, you can spray clear over the top without mixing too. This will increase the depth of the gloss. More importantly, the clear over the top gives you a coat that can be cut and buffed without having to work about changing the color at all.Register or Log In To remove these advertisements.
I've been reading quite alot on this subject. Seems there are varying views; I have already bought all my paint materials minus the clearso I'm not changing anything, just looking for opinions and some real world experience. Currently the inside of the cab has been painted with color, and the rest of the exterior is awaiting more blocking and priming. Wetsand everything with grit paper. Paint looks great, nice and shiney with very little orangepeel - but I do have some VERY slight dirt specs in the paint.
I painted it in my garage, and am by no means a professional painter. My truck will be a daily driver, and I am happy with the results as she sits now, buy I have a couple of questions: 1.Rustoleum vs. Single Stage vs. Base/Clear (Sample Panels)
If I wanted, can I colorsand the single stage paint to make it perfect? I want my paint to be as durable as possible, so I'm wondering about applying clear over the single stage to act as a protectant.
I don't need the shine as the single stage currently looks like a mirror, just looking to protect the paint as much as possible. Or am I overthinking this whole thing and should just keep her waxed up? Also, the color coat is only 3 days old and the truck hasn't left the garage, so it would be easy to do the clear with a basic scuff job prior to spraying.
Sorry for the long winded thread, but just looking for any help and or real world experience with this type of deal. Attached Images. Find More Posts by ryanmctee. Great job! It's a 3M product, commonly referred to as black wax.
Perfect-It They also offer Finesse-It that is good too. Old school stuff but just what I have used over the years. Let me start off by saying that i know very little about painting vehicles. Seeing that you went for it in your garage gets me thinking that i might try it.
It looks great. I have seen some pretty old single stage paint come back really nicely. So that goes for a work truck, but if you are keeping yours in your garage, and are going to take care of it and wax it regularly, a clear coat would probably suit you just fine. So after all that i guess i'm not really helping your decision any, just passing along a little info that i've learned.
Good luck, the truck looks sweet and i love the color! Thanks for the compliment yfsp. I'm a firm believer that if a body guy can make a paintjob look great, so can I.
All it takes is time tons of it and the will to make it as perfect as you can get it. I'm leaning towards not clearing as the inside of the cab is now three days old and looks great, not to mention as hard as a rock. I'm currently blocking and glazing the bed for the second time.
Will probably prime it at least two more times prior to paint. Thanks again for the compliment and reference to the landscape trucks. This truck is going to be a daily driver, but a great looking one at that! How many coats of color do you have on it?Should I do single stage or base coat clear coat? Some say single stage dulls faster, but it can be polished out. When I worked in the body shops we had Lacquer or enamel We never put clear coat over anything. Times have changed. Since you are shooting what appears to be a solid non metallic color single stage would be the easiest.
I usually shoot single stage enamel on my projects now as to me once it is colored sanded and buffed it gives a look closest to old time lacquer. That was it selling point.
How to Tell If Your Car Has Single Stage Paint
Shoot it and be done. More of a softer shine,as it were. When you shoot SS you should lay it on as wet as you can. To many people spray it too dry and think that they can sand it out and polish it to make it shine. I just shot some BC-CC on a friends newer car. It was not baked and it will hold up just fine even in our harsh Northern Michigan winters. I would not CC over single stage. Not formulated for it and you may have adhesion issues.
Plus it is a waste of money as Paint products are very costly these days. Both of these pics show single stage paint that has NOT been sanded and buffed. This is how it should look when dry.
Good luck and have fun with it.
I know many a seasoned builder that would never think to paint a car. Just ask Ian. He painted his 37 Chevy custom truck in his garage and it looks great. Great advice from Torchie! As one who was stuck in the lacquer days, I had to be dragged whining and protesting into the HVLP modern days of paints that can kill you, instead of a lacquer buzz, or an enamel headache. I chose single stage because, well several unreasonable grouchy old man reasons. But for me, that was the rub.
By spraying single stage, I could concentrate on the single task at hand. And know I could manage the process and sequence. And see what I achieved was just what I was going to get. But we all are watching our California painters in rapt attention. Those, and Charlie Hutton. If you have the time to shoot it all at once then that is no problem.
With a SS non metallic color like that yellow you could get away with panel spraying it. In other words each part separately as time allows. The advantage of this is that you can do many of the parts off the car as well as not having to deal with arm fatigue which is a very real thing if you are not used to holding a spray gun full of paint in your hand with your arm extended over that air craft carrier sized Caddy hood and roof…. For home painters Lacquer was always the most forgiving but the cost involved with it now if you can get it are out of sight.
One last piece of unasked for advice.We were discussing how much life could be brought back to the car with a paint correction. Despite the rather caveman-esque proof that there was a clear coat on the car, I maintained that most of it was still the original single stage.
Why was that? Because he had also performed an easy, yet effective test without even knowing it. He had tried using a cleaner wax on the rest of the car and noticed the towel turning the color of the paint. Later that night he went home to google it and found out that Pheonix Yellow Integra Type Rs were indeed sprayed with single stage paint.
The bumper with the clear coat flaking off was likely repainted by a low-end body shop at some point. This article is intended to share how I identify, work on, and protect these 2 different types of paint systems.
In short, single stage paint is like any other paint job — but without a clear coat on top. Single stage paint is most commonly found on older vehicles, although certain colors offered by certain automakers are still single stage to this day.
For example, white Toyota trucks often still use single stage paint.
Single stage paints were very common on Japanese cars in the 80s and 90s. Non-metallic colors like white, black, red and yellow were often single stage. This is of course just a generalization and there are many exceptions. Some single stage paints are hard, and some brand new vehicles have soft clear coats. But once the paint has been applied to a vehicle, there are really only 2 differences that will affect the average car owner:.
Oxidized single stage paint has a very dull, chalky look and feel. Why is that? Because the top coat is intended to be clear. On the other hand, the top layer of yellow single stage paint is just that — yellow. This is a common misconception about single stage paint. I can understand why it would shock them…. The color shows up on your buffing pad and towels.
In the case of my red MR2, my garage looks like a bloody crime scene when I polish it! You will remove the exact same amount of paint when polishing a clear coat as you will with single stage. People with paint correction experience will be able to tell when a pad becomes loaded or dirty by other factors, such as the way the paint is cutting, or the amount of dust coming from the pad.
The untrained eye, however, will think no paint has been removed. I think a certain level of healthy fear is needed when doing a paint correction.
What products do I need? To reduce the confusion, Eastwood developed its own line of single-stage urethane paints with the first-time painter in mind. This is a professional-quality paint system that's easy to mix, easy to apply, and easy on the wallet.
Understanding mix ratios is something that often causes confusion. To clear-up that issue, Eastwood Single-Stage Urethane Paint comes in a gallon can filled with 3 quarts of reduced paint. Simply pour-in the one quart of activator, stir, and you have a full gallon of sprayable material.
Since single-stage urethanes are basically clear coat with color pigment added, these paints can be sprayed as is, or clear coat can be used afterwards for additional shine and protection. When repainting a vehicle, you will either strip the vehicle to bare metal or paint over an existing finish.
Depending on which route you decide to go, there are different primers to use. Most full restorations involve stripping the vehicle down to bare metal.
This allows you to see what's hiding under the existing finish and ensure that any damage is properly repaired. Because bare metal starts to rust almost immediately, it's a good idea to apply a primer as soon as possible.
This primer offers excellent adhesion to bare metal and provides a proper foundation for your paint job. The mix ratio makes it easy to mix one part primer to one part catalyst.
It can be topcoated from 30 minutes after application up to five days later, without sanding. If topcoating after five days, a scuff sand is required. The other scenario when painting a vehicle is to paint over the existing finish. This practice is perfectly acceptable, as long as the existing finish is solid and in good shape not flaking or cracking. If the vehicle has been repainted multiple times over existing finishes in the past, it is generally best to strip the vehicle down.
If you're unsure about hidden repairs under the finish, it's also a good idea to strip the vehicle down. For both these primers, thoroughly clean and degrease the existing finish, then sand it with grit be sure all traces of wax are removed prior to sanding. After sanding, clean and degrease again. This primer has a mix ratio 4 parts primer to 1 part activator.
Prior to block sanding, apply a light coat of guide coat to highlight any problem areas when sanding. Guide coat is simply a different color primer or powder that is applied to the surface. During sanding, low areas will be highlighted by the guide coat left behind. Prior to applying your color, ensure that you have thoroughly prepared the surface for paint. After cleaning and degreasing the surface to be painted, sand with grit, working your way up to grit.Many types of urethane paints require that you paint your car in stages, applying several different coats that must then be allowed to dry before the next coat is added.
Depending on the sequence of steps, wet sanding is usually advised at various stages of the process, and with a process that takes four or more coats you can expect to sand twice.
Single-stage urethane bypasses some of these time-consuming steps, but at a cost. When urethane paints are applied in stages, the last stage is applying the "clear coat" or layer of protector design to add to the sheen of the paint and protect it from damage.
This is not part of the urethane process, but it is common even with single-stage urethane paints. If you choose to use a clear coat, be sure to do any necessary sanding first, since afterward you will be forced to sand through the clear coat itself.
When using a single-stage paint that has a chemical hardener, you will probably need to wait only 24 hours or so before sanding. The hardener allows the paint to dry faster and more crisply, so sanding will be more effective earlier on in the process. Urethane coats that progress in stages do not generally use this type of hardener, since the layers naturally build on top of one another, but single stage brands use it to provide the necessary support to the single layer.
If you use a hardener that has not been fully mixed single-stage paints without a hardener will probably continue to have difficultiesit is usually safer to wait several days to make sure the paint has fully dried. You should only sand your urethane coat to remove problem areas, such as scratches, ridges, bubbles or other problems that have developed in the paint.
Wet sanding uses a mixture of wet grit and sandpaper to sand down these flaws into a smooth surface. In multi-coat processes, to grit-level sandpaper can be used, followed by to rated paper in the end to remove all blemishes.
Can You Sand Single Stage Urethane Paint?
But with a single-stage paint job, you should use only grade sandpaper and use an electric sander or buffer instead of doing it by hand. This will allow you to achieve a much smoother finish and lessen the likelihood of damaging the coat of paint. Single stage urethane coats, especially on metallic colors, can become dulled by the sanding process.
Sometimes this dulling is expected, and you can solve it by applying protective coats of wax as soon as the paint has cured. At other times you run the risk of permanently dulling the paint, so always be careful when sanding. This article was written by the It Still Runs team, copy edited and fact checked through a multi-point auditing system, in efforts to ensure our readers only receive the best information.
To submit your questions or ideas, or to simply learn more about It Still Runs, contact us. About the Author This article was written by the It Still Runs team, copy edited and fact checked through a multi-point auditing system, in efforts to ensure our readers only receive the best information.